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Discussion in 'Pre Wash, Wash, Decon, Claying, Engine, Wheels, an' started by eShine, Oct 17, 2008.

  1. Buddy

    Buddy Getting to know Detailing

    I asked for an answer and boy did I get one. The truth doesn't hurt any more than it hurts me. Well the heck with it. I'm not going to worry about it anymore. If We have to use clay sold by this little twerp. Then so be it. I hope he chokes on it...
  2. Dannyk

    Dannyk Jedi Nuba

    Thanks for pointing this out, the process this guy is using is uncanny. time will tell.
  3. Eliot Ness

    Eliot Ness Any Rag Vehicle Washer

    May I suggest that you plan your next vacation in beautiful Canada. I hear that Port Colborne, Ontario is absolutely lovely.

    The good clay is still obtainable, but it is getting more and more difficult to find in the states. Those of us who were around when AW was putting companies out of business stocked up on some extra clay, but if I knew the full extent of how long this was going to effect us I would have bought a lot more.

    The good stuff was also rebranded and sold under a few different names. About a year ago an extensive internet search yielded me the last three bars a vendor had in stock. I did find one other source but they never replied to my e-mails and I didn't trust ordering from them.

    I'm sure there are still some brick and mortar stores that have some good yellow clay gathering dust on their shelves, but the trick is to find them, but occasionally I read where someone stopped in an out-of-the-way shop and found a small stash.

    The good news is that Chris is selling it. That doesn't do us any good right now here in the states, but it means that as soon as the patent expires we'll be able to buy it again. Some of us were concerned that the law suits put all the manufactures out of business and we might never see the good clay again.

    I don't think the lawsuit covers the UK either, but I haven't been able to verify that, or if the yellow clay some of them sell is the good elastic stuff.

    So if you don't have some of the old clay stashed away about all you can do is use what is currently being sold in the states (all made by CM). CM makes a decent clay, but I personally liked the elastic clay much better. I thought, like many in the industry, that there was enough of a difference to thwart their lawsuits. Unfortunately we were all wrong and some companies went out of business. I still say if the judge/s had gotten off their a$$es and actually used each clay and saw/felt the difference we wouldn't be without our good clay today.
  4. Nica

    Nica Banned

    I just can't wait to see this blue Riccardo clay bar...:woo:
  5. Duratys

    Duratys Welcome to Detailing

    Agreed....Something with a bit more bite will be nice for the tougher jobs.
  6. Nica

    Nica Banned

    :nod: you bet :headbang: :headbang:
  7. Cooter

    Cooter Guest

  8. junebug

    junebug Jedi Nuba

    Well, I've read other articals about this before and I haven't seen anything that would change my mind. I agree with AM, they have the patents and therefore it's their clay. They've had to go to court to prove it and they have several times.
  9. reefer_bob

    reefer_bob Obsessive Detailer

    Little confused here.

    Riccardo Clay is not CM, only available from Canada is not available to us in the US.

    Who makes the Blit Hamber clay? Is it really leagally ok for Rubbish Boy to send it to the USA?

    What are the old yellow brands of clay that are still good to keep an eye out for in our local stores?
  10. PJS

    PJS Birth of a Detailer

    Ben is outside the US patent's legal remit, so yes he is legally allowed to sell to individual users.
    Besides, there's a difference in the BH Auto-clay that the patent can't claim infringement on, but I don't think with a couple of years only to go, that BH or any interested distributor want to get embroiled in a legal battle, where the only winners are the lawyers!
  11. Nica

    Nica Banned

    Not sure if what your saying is correct there PJS, but I don't think Ben is excepted from the clay patent. If I remember correctly Ben has gone through this before.
  12. eShine

    eShine Guest

    Actually no. John's Clay was and still is a completely different formula than the AWC and he still lost in court. The patent does not go into ingredients it covers what the product does and how. As long as it is a "moldable Grinding stone" that remove paint contamination it infringes. This is why companies have tried the whole, liquid clay, clay foam etc. Bilt-Hamber clay can not be sold without infringing on patents period. Just because some has been sold and nothing has happened does not mean it can't/won't happen.
  13. PJS

    PJS Birth of a Detailer

    I believe Pete, the BH owner and chemist, has looked into the patent, and that what I've posted, is a paraphrase of his post in DW - I'll see if I can dig it out.
    As he has filed a number of patents himself for various things, I imagine he fully understands the patent's scope, and why his would stand up under scrutiny.

    An individual buying a clay bar from an outside-the-US company would be exempt from the grounds of the patent, since the scope of the patent itself only extends to sellers/manufacturers within the US and Japan - it was never filed for European coverage.

    So, I see no reason for Ben or 911Fanatic to be concerned about continuing to supply their US-based customers with the BH versions, and it'll only be US Customs that could put a spanner in the works, but even that's highly unlikely, and verging on paranoia.
  14. MelF1fan

    MelF1fan Birth of a Detailer

    Guess, i'll have to hold on to my couple Opti-Clay bars and start using up my mothers yellow clay(cough, crap magic)
  15. mdun6

    mdun6 DB Forum Supporter

    This post really cought my eye because i worked in body shops when clay first came out but it was labeled Overspray Clay as I remember. I believe it was made by Meguires. I have tried the Clay Magic kit form Autozone and found it wasnt near as effective as the Meguires I had used. Now I need more clay and I don't plan on giving Auto Wax any of my money. Since I have not been able to get Riccardo Clay I ordered some Bilt Hamber and will try it.
  16. eShine

    eShine Guest

    The Meguiars Clay was likely made by Aut Wax company, they will make you any clay you want as long as you buy it from them. Bilt Hamber is in the same boat as Riccardo. You may be able to get it but who sells it to you is infringing on a patent also.
  17. mdun6

    mdun6 DB Forum Supporter

    Well the supplier I ordered it from shipped it to me. I'll never tell who it was.
  18. Zechariaha

    Zechariaha Any Rag Vehicle Washer

    interesting i was able to pick up some Riccardo clay yesterday, havent used it yet. The guy told me it is an "elasticy" type of clay bar is this right?
  19. mdun6

    mdun6 DB Forum Supporter

    Yeah i'm looking forward to trying Riccardo Clay when I can get my hands on some.
  20. hoppy6698

    hoppy6698 Birth of a Detailer

    So is Riccardo the only non-AWC clay available in the US?

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