does the rupes have you reevaluating your pricing?

Oh snap. Lol. Well put Bob.

 

Well Franki, making a wrong pad/polish choice and saying the machine doesn't perform isn't being fair at all. Why not throw the surbuf on and use 101 and cut the paint like a mofo but leave it gray? Is that the machines fault? Maybe you could have gone with the finishing pad and perfect finish or power finish with a hint of finishing polish? You could have used a rotary with rocks in a bottle, but is it the rotaries fault for the crappy finish, I think not.
sent using my thumbs, mispelling most words

 

Well, the intention of this thread wasn't to create a bob's a bully cause he does Ferraris thread. Bob knows I always laugh at this statement. As far as the how long you've been detailing for, things can always come along that you don't see for years. For me it took 15 years to see my first titanium exhaust and yes bob gave me a tidbit of knowledge when asked, because he does them quite a bit.
There have been many guys in here asking how can I make more money, my location city doesn't rock millionaires. Don't forget Bob, the pool of people in California is much greater than other places and California has some of the most affluent communities in America with the technology wizards. For the guy out in flint, the pool may be non existent of the same caliber of clientele. The drive to do the best is not a bad thing at all , as being comfortable in mediocre won't gain you money over the years. From a plain business aspect, if you can deliver a smile to the customer in less time and charge the same, you made more money. It doesn't mean you have to cut corners, just work smarter with the various tools.

sent using my thumbs, mispelling most words

 

For Paul, the types of cars I work on are similar to what you have posted up. But its not like I segregate what I get, I don't care I guess the workin hard and making a certain level of finish allows me to work in decent cars day in and day out. On top of that I work when I can at an exotics dealership where the owner could very well be a clone of Bob. The expectations are high, and the work is long. I have done 20+ hour correction work on a number of cars there, which is a rare case as the car lots want speed and cover ups. My boss chewed out the the new guy because he thought banging some glaze on it was where its at. The hurricane he faced was not what he was expecting at all. He now corrects finishes. Many customers paruse through the collection and are blown away by the paint finishes and the level of cleaness of the cars. That's a good feeling for the guys( myself included) that work there and put in the hours cause it appears the "haves" have no idea how not to destroy their Aston martin, lambo ect. My main goal at the shop was to train the guys to create better overall cars in efficient working time, (sans rupes) and more on organization and proper tooling.

sent using my thumbs, mispelling most words

 

Well I have enjoyed the thread thus far, which considering it started with one question about a piece of equipment is pretty cool.

sent using my thumbs, mispelling most words

 

It’s has nothing to do with the kinds of cars you do, the level to which each one is restored or if you do this by yourself or with a crew. This is about getting from point A to point B in a faster amount of time, but not charging any less for it because you were smart enough to stay up on the latest trends. Pricing by the hour or step to me just isn’t the standard to which I feel needs to be followed for what *I* do. I would hope that I haven’t come across as condemning anyone that thinks otherwise? I learned this shortly after semi-retiring my wool/rotary and not charging extra for that “jeweling” step which after all this time makes no sense to me. Yes, those may or may not have their place in everyone’s bag of tricks, but I’m talking about the general standardization of my pricing. I have clients that are still on the hourly bandwagon and you know what, it works for them so keep on keeping on. For me to switch momentum at this point wouldn’t quite work. But anyone/thing new gets quoted in price ranges. I would hope that this isn’t a new concept to anyone charging by the hour? It’s not like an hourly job isn’t priced in time ranges. If you’re skilled enough to look at a job and shoot someone a figure in an hourly range, why not just break that down into your estimated cost per hour and try to beat the clock for more profit? Body shops and mechanical shops do this daily.

 

Dave,

I have ALREADYsaid some of what you put in the quote above before.............................on Autopia, on more than one occasion(Sans the Jewelling part as if you are paid for the extra time and can do it and you do not because................................). Bryan you are not getting the hint, the goal is to be profitable for EVERY HOUR you are working on the car and having a buffer that saves you time(Enough to actually make a difference btw) had you over thinking the process imo plain and simple.

When I have a conversation for example with a liberal on almost any subjuect I get the same kind of retorts where a position is taken upon the foundation of "Not really knowing what they are talking about" and in no time flat people are spinning into "What about this n that".

The statement Dave makes above about getting from A to B faster does not line up with anything...........................I know this Dave, alot of people think they are "Smart" for charging for 8 hours and doing only 3 or 4........................ yes on one hand it can make up for times when you estimate improperly or don't charge for everything you should have but coming out ahead is a far cry from not doing what you charged for and promised the client.....................in my view this is dishonest and I know a couple of guys who do this and brag about how the client doesn't know any better which is different than coming out ahead of "Book time" which I covered more than a few pages ago (But as you are late to the movie and started commenting on the plot without knowing the whole story as usual).

I recieved a text on my phone from someone in a different time zone(Wife was again "Who the hell is that texting you @ 4:40 in the morning!!!!!!!) as this happens sometimes as guys forget the time zone difference. I could not get too mad as I will paraphrase some of his enlightening remarks............................ Bob I have to laugh at some of the guys who make comments at you, on one hand they are looking for advice or confirmation from you or the other guys on the forum in the thread, and when you reply I see at first a gentle style of advice but then you can see your frustration build when guys do not "Get it". I can also see where you are coming from but maybe you should not get so heavy handed in your replies as you have said about yourself in the past and this is just a suggestion as sometimes you can lead a horse to water but cannot make them drink.

So as I said it is a paraphrase of what was said as I do not want to say who it was, also this guy pointed out I should tone it down a notch(Or ten lol) and I can agree with that assertion but I just hate to waist time going round n round n round over the same things. Bottom line you can do WHATEVER you think is right, but if your business is not getting any traction or you come upon dead ends continually.........................

 

Well I guess I don't feel as bad knowing I am not the only one that forget the timezones as well. i get the hours are hours, idea. I have a different slant, and of course everyone will do as they feel comfortable with. I think the major thing is that, I do believe my time is worth more than it used to. Your clients are probably very pleased you can correct stuff with the quickness as it means bob can work through more cars. I am guessing your booking list may be longer than a double roll of toilet paper, so if i was a perspective client I would have a huge smile on my face as bob may touch my car sooner. Or you may end up using that time for more personal matters, I get that as well as my son and wife would love to see dad more if they could. In the end I don't feel bad for leveraging my efficiency. I hope others don't see this thread as another guy jealous of bob's business, cause I do have great respect for bob and his business that he has built through years of sweat the willingness not to be just satisfied. I also know that not every situation is the same and believing so will lead to failure. The same will go for any of the other guys I think push the business in the right direction. I am sure Kevin Brown and Jason Rose get tired of hearing their names all the time, but hey they have worked very hard to make things better than they used to. I can only imagine what went into the KBM and the following stellar documentation. I think everyone can agree there are definitely some great nuggets of information here, which in my opinion can be lacking on open forums. at 3000+ reads, there is obviously people taking the time to read through the views. Mike and I had a great exchange as he is thinking accounting, along with me. I can also see numbers don't don't make products or services, they are just that, numbers. My business this year got some traction, and I am proud that my years of delivering to customers has started to pay off. It has been years though, and I am realist to know that in a business that depends so much on reputation, you need to earn that and trickery and false promises won't keep you in business over the long term.
I appreciate the time bob and others have taken to put their views in, as hours are hours and them spending some of that to add to this forum are greatly appreciated. Time is one thing you can't change, it just goes away.

 

It's not always about how people just don't get it, sometimes it's about how people refuse to admit that they get it, for whatever their reasons are. If the Rupes or any other tool allows you to complete your work in less amount of time, then that's great, but the pricing is up to you. If you charged per hour, then you bill for hours worked, but if you charged per car, then the price is still for completing the car and doing what was promised to the customer. That pricing is derived from how good you are and your self branding, etc.

If McDonalds comes up with a way to make food even faster, thus increasing the number of customers it can feed in a day, will they reduce prices since they take in more customers, or will they keep the prices the same and consider that a higher profit margin? I don't think I've seen any food vendors reduce prices in a long time even though technology makes their jobs easier/faster ...

 

opcorn:

 

but you can't honestly blame the tool though, can you. It would be sort of like when I hit an 8 iron on a shot that should have required a 9 iron, it it my 8 irons fault I flew the green? Trust me, I have blamed many clubs in my day because it was easier than calling my self an idiot. In the end i knew i blew it.

 

This could be so easy. All one is doing by upgrading to a better polisher is becoming more efficient. That's what all corporations strives for, whether you're a group of 2 or a massive 10,000 employee giant. Efficiency creates a higher profit margin. So you can give some of it away to retain customers, or you can keep it.

All quite simple really.

 

Thank you Piet. Principles of business can remain the same no matter the size of the company in question.

 

No cannot blame the tool, I'll retract the statement I made earlier about the rupes not finishing properly.

 

Bryan he had 4 hours to do everything, me thinks machine or not is not the problem but a client in most likelyhood did not want to pay so pad choice is not the issue........what is going on here?.

 

No need Franki......................the tool is not designed for that, kinda of like using the right Golf club.

 

agreed, expectations were greater than the time frame given, giving Franki the impossible feat. however maybe offering less for the the agreed time frame would have been better, than trying to getting 10 hours of cut into 4 hours of work. If someone came to me and said I want my hammered Escalade mint in 5 hours, my response would be find someone else. I know my limits and I try and stick to my adage of under promising and over delivering. flipping that will ensure a ish storm. When you do 100% correction all the time, the customer doesn't have the haggle room. if you want perfect you pay for it.

 

I do not always do 100% as it is not always needed, let's get back on points that further the discourse rather than detract from it(Sans my bully tactics of course lol).

 

just echoing Paul, on his statement of what correction is. I know as many others do that you can't do 100% sometimes as the paint doesn't allow it. this is where people have to be careful on their deliverables, and ensuring that the proper assessment is done before stating the deliverable. If you don't know you can do something, don't promise it to the customer. Something I am sure we have all done before we got smart.

 

I don't want to get into details, but the rupes 21 mm definitely has its place, IME ( few times using it ) is best use to cut. I think the 15mm will finish better than the 21mm. But should it replace your rotary, 8 mm DA polishers ? My answer is no, every tool has its place. I was working on a soft paint, and I had to resort to the rotary to finish properly, because all the DAs was mirco-marring.