A Question of Ethics: Customer Maintenance

As a professional paint polisher, I'm always weighing the ability of the client to maintain his own paint versus what I can do to perfect his paint. I'm wondering what the general consensus is on perfecting paint that the owner can't possibly take care of. Do you make it perfect even if it requires more work, knowing full well that in order for the client to maintain it, extraordinary measures will need to be taken?

I'm referring to cars with ultra soft paint that mar with a clean microfiber towel. I'm working on some paint right now that is so soft that an LC Black Pad is jeweling the finish with the Flex...normally that pad is my wax applicator and an LC Red Hydro Pad is for jeweling.

For ultra soft paints, there are many shortcuts that can be taken from using a glaze to improve the finish temporarily, instead of perfecting a process that allows the paint to be perfectly polished. I always prefer to remove instead of conceal whenever it's feasible but sometimes the best solution is a mix of both.

Thoughts? Richard

 

If the customer wants perfect I would have to say you have to give it to them. also i believe you should educate the customer on his paint, the care of it etc. which I'm sure you already do.

 

I agree for sure, and yes, education is definitely key. However, when I'm faced with a car that has ultra soft paint that requires me to take very special precautions to polish, I know the sad fact that it won't take much time for the paint to become scratched and swirled again. I'm working on a 2011 BMW 550 in Jet Black and while I love this paint, the initial condition was a wreck.

Though the customer wanted the sprinkler water spots removed, the paint was badly swirled and scratched, and my experience with this paint is such that everything that comes in contact during the restore process should be new..from microfibers to polishing pads otherwise marring will happen. I know I can polish the paint to a level that the customer will be happy with and would be considered "good enough". However, I know that I can go even further and with additional steps, really make it look amazing..but it won't stay that way due to his inability to maintain it and he wouldn't pay me to maintain it either.

I guess that's really my question. What level of "perfect" is appropriate? Perfect in the customer's eyes or perfect to you, the paint polisher?

 

how about putting cquartz on it?

 

I have limited experience with CQ, but I would be afraid that the application process could introduce marring into the ultra soft paint. Of the black cars I have used CQ with, I had some issues during initial removal that made me worry about using on ultra soft paints.

I wouldn't mind hearing from others, but the problem with ultra soft paint is that every time you wipe it, you risk marring it. So the IPA wipe down has the potential to marring it. Even the IronX usage could introduce marring. In my experience, you want to minimize the number of times you need to wipe it after polishing for best results.

 

Totally agree with Phil- I take a few minutes to figure out the commitment level of the Client, then decide if the Client wants to know about maintaining their finish or not, and if so, give them advice on this particular vehicle's paint, etc., and if they dont even want to know, BUT are entrusting me to do the best/right thing for their Baby, then I will set their expectations accordingly.

I really like making paint perfect, but if the price point choice is not to do that, then I will always advise the Client what they will be getting, how much total paint thickness is available to use, and advise them that each time I see their Vehicle/s in the future, unless something terrible happens to their paintwork, it will only get better and better, because I will be maintaining their paintwork, and keeping it beautiful for them.

It appears to me that as the world gets more crazy busy and more and more tools are available to keep everyone "in touch" with their jobs, family, Tweets,Texting, Linkin's,, etc, etc., there will be more and more opportunities for good Detailers to be pretty much in charge of many vehicle's outside and inside maintenance, because the owners first of all, have seen your great, world-class work, and smelled what a really cleaned interior and Leather really smells like (and really like this), and now entrust you fully to take care of their vehicles for the long term.

Dan F

 

here is other point. to customer it might look good, to you it might not. say somebody else looks at car and notices that something is wrong and asks customer who did it and they will say you did. think of what kinda impresion that guy will have of you

 

Yes, but you are missing the point. If I make the paint flawless, and after the first wash that the owner does, even with a two bucket method, and he adds light marring in the paint because it's ultra soft, it doesn't matter what I did or did not do. He's not going to take the same care with the paint as I would to maintain that flawless finish no matter how hard he tries. Remember the key point here. Ultra Soft Paint that mars when you wipe it.

 

This is a tricky subject. I mean I would do the best job you can and correct the defects. But I mean it all comes down to proper care on the client`s side as well. And educating them on how to properly wash their own car is sometimes crucial.. There are tons of people out there who have no idea they are scratching their paint as they wash it. All they care about is seeing that dirt and grime come off.. Just my :2cents:!

 

You are being paid to bring the vehicle's paint to a certain level, in this case it sounds like it's pretty close to 100% perfection. When a customer comes and picks up the vehicle, it's not wrong to let him/her know what lengths you had to go through to get that paint there. Should a customre wish to keep the paint looking that way, then sell them the products to help them best. Of course, there is a certain finesse involved, as we all know that the products only do so much and that the rest comes with experience.

If glazing is the best solution, there is nothing wrong with that.

PS: I can feel your paint. BMW Jet Black should be illegal.

 

So should all subaru paint............. atleat on the STI.

 

A quick customer demonstration might be in order for this to work out but...

I don't detail for $, but if I did, and this situation came up, I might offer 2 seperated packages on particularly soft paints.

The first package would include polishing everything to absloute perfection, using no glaze, fillers etc., and naturally would cost a bit more.

The second package would include taking out the deepest of swirls, minus what many call the jeweling process, and include a relatively durable glaze and would cost the customer less than the first package.

This way, the customer is informed of the nuances of his paint, and has the choice to pay based on the time it will take to finish per the package description.

 

Richard- a thought provoking post

 

Heh heh, yes it is, lol.

I also suspect that a lot of people have never worked on ultra soft paint or have never truly taken ultra soft paint to such a perfect state. I think most people would agree that BMW Jet Black is a PIA to polish. Do it right and the paint purity/clarity is blinding under bright lights and is perfect without any glazes but is polished to such a high degree that the slightest of defects are revealed...a swipe of the finger on the paint shows marring. When I had a Jet Black MINI daily driver and I lived in an apartment with a carport, I had to just get used to the fact that very light swirls would exist despite my best efforts to maintain it, but would be significantly less than any other car, and I relied on maintenance products with fillers to keep the paint looking good to maximize paint depth for the long term.

 

And on the flip side of this, I had a customer come to me wanting perfection, I informed him that the way he is currently maintaining the vehicle will only lead to more swirls, so he let me know I would be the one maintaining it from then on, cool so I spent the time bringing the finish to perfection, he was very pleased, so much so he took pics after I was done, after 2 weeks he calls to get a wash, but upon arriving I looked over the vehicle and noticing spots that were clean and spots that were dirty, looking closer I see his towel marks were he missed spots while washing it himself, he pushed very hard in areas putting deep scratches back into the paint and minor swirls all over, I was upset, needless to say some customers are just gonna do what they want regardless of how you educate them or what they promise you

 

Every customer that pays for correction gets a dissertation by me explaining what will be needed to maintain the paint – I tell them, why spend the money if you can’t maintain it.

I have yet to have a customer that came to me asking for correction decline after my very thorough and honest explanation on how it is not for every person/car.

I explain:
• The cost
• The amount of work (time) it takes to maintain
• The investment ($) it takes in proper tools & chemicals to maintain
• That clear coat is a non replenishable source and that we are removing CC and once it’s gone, it’s gone.

If after all this, the prospect still wants correction, they get what they want and I feel I did my part to properly educate them so that if they come back with a swirled up mess I know I did all I can to make sure they were in the “know”

 

Please Piet, don't touch the paint :lol2:

 

Richard,

The bumpers of my Mazda are very much like what you describe...When you have the chance, try something like po106fa or po85rd on a mf bonnet. I find that polishing with a mf bonnet over a soft pad is the easiest way for me to get ultra soft paints perfect in short order.

Cloths that pass the "cd test" still marr the paint... but mf bonnets help me a great deal.

 

I know what you mean. I own a jet black BMW that my wife has as a daily driver. I have driven myself nuts trying to keep it looking perfect. I finally realized that it was just a futile effort and accepted the fact that it would only look perfect for a short time after I corrected it. I follow the exact same regimine you used for your MINI for the BMW now.

I also follow the same protocol that Deep Gloss does when trying to help a client decide if they want/need full paint correction.

 

Paint as soft as we are speaking of always makes me wonder what damage I would do if I applied a wax by hand, as some of the manufacturers recommend.

I don't know about you guys, but I don't trust my hands running across the paint, especially in the winter, when my hands are much more rough.